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In light of this year being the tenth year

Discussion of quizbowl topics not related to specific tournaments
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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by L-Town Expatriate »

With all those posts we had of Best Players and Best Coaches, should we go ahead and pull ten from those for a page on the site called "The ten most influential players and coaches of the past ten years?" (Or shorter title)

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by mujason »

Here are some nominees:
Coaches: Larry Allen (NKC), Bill Luce (Savannah), Roger Stephens (Richland), Troy Kinast (TJ), Gary Durbin (Cuba), Vicki Jones (Liberty), Bonnie Wagner (Parkway Central), Madeline Gillis (Mound City), Jim McCrary (Lexington), Frank Corley (Priory).

Players: Mike Wehrman (NKC), Andy Wehrman (NKC), Adam Hill (Nixa), Chris Ottolino (Parkway Central), Kyle Hill (Liberty), Jimmy Li (Parkway Central), Ryan Manuel (Blue Springs), Melissa McCush (Savannah), Kim Kerr (Savannah), Sean Phillips (Boonville), Bobby Gray (Elsberry), Kevin Smith (Richland), Jason Kathcart (Richland), Matt Chadbourne (Viburnum), Jim Driscoll (Koshkonong), Travis Eakin (Bell City), James Black (Galena), and myself.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by MissCae »

I was going to commend Jason for checking his ego and not putting himself on the list, until I finished reading it and found "myself" at the end.

I think this could be interesting, I'd have to pull out my old state programs to make a list. For starters, I'd add Danny Wise from Savannah, Mike Ruby of Liberty, and Jon Matthew of NKC to the list.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by mujason »

I had to put myself on it; I still have the Class 2 scoring record. Yeah, I remember hearing that Mr. Wise put up some good numbers. Come to think of it, Greg Martin was good, too.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by L-Town Expatriate »

Note that Mueller has 18 nominees, not ten.

Honestly, if I were to make it onto such a list, I'd probably be close to eighth or ninth spot.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by mujason »

Well, in terms of nominees, I got exactly ten coaches whom I listed in semirandom order, as for players, I've seen and heard of many fine players and meant for the nominees to be edited (added to and then trimmed) before settling on ten, and I listed them from Class 4 down to Class 1.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by JimmyL »

i'd put the current savannah team on the list.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by East Buc & UMR »

Well for coaches they is only 4 in my eyes. They have provided a lead for MO quiz bowl, and in the eyes of the nation. Luce, Allen, Durbin, and McCrary. The other may be good coaches but have not done what these four men have done.

as for players

Mike, Melissa, Adam, Andy, Chris, Sean, Paul N, Kyle, Paul S, and Justin

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by L-Town Expatriate »

McCrary!? Lexington's never been to a national tournament!!

(Have they?)

Regardless, I'd put him on the top ten.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by East Buc & UMR »

He may not have been but his in state stuff is what gets him up there

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by DavidH »

Well... I'd have to add Greg Martin. He was a great player even though someone wasn't that fond of him.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by MissCae »

Yes, Greg was a good player, he just got on your nerves after a while. That and he could be a real jerk. A huge, annoying jerk whom you had to spend years with fighting over toss-ups and being the captain. But he was good, especially at history.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by DavidH »

Haha :lol: I heard of some of the crap he pulled... like taking the SMS History scholarship just to make the "fat girl cry!" Terrible, but funny.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by mujason »

He's here at Mizzou; I got him to come to one practice. He looked pretty good, if he had kept at it, he'd probably be starting for us.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by MissCae »

Greg and I were heavily influenced by Danny and the varsity team as freshmen and sophmores, which probably explains Greg's behavior, and some of my own (and the occasional foul language). We could be pretty cruel to each other. And yeah, Greg did take the scholarship to make her cry, which I think she did.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by East Buc & UMR »

Looks like Luce needs to teach some ethics

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by MissCae »

Greg had a right to the scholarship since we won, and he "might" go to SMS, but yeah, it was bad. He tried, believe me, to tone down the language, but sometimes you just let it slip. When you're the only girl on a varsity team full of boys, you adopt some of their dirty habits.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by tcarroll »

the question said "most influential"... you're all just listing the best players and we've already done that hundreds of times. Hundreds.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by L-Town Expatriate »

tcarroll wrote: the question said "most influential"... you're all just listing the best players and we've already done that hundreds of times. Hundreds.
Typically the best players are the most influential, but sometimes the dark horse comes riding in.

Like Diana, who went 6-for-7 against Parkway in the state game two years ago. She didn't even buzz in more than twice in any other game.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by tcarroll »

eh... i'd say the most influential players are among the best, but not necessarily the other way around.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by missouriacademic »

Great idea! I'd like to do something like this for the web site.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by MissCae »

Yeah, I agree with tcarroll, what exactly makes a player influential? I understand how a coach can be influential (state and/or national titles, a consistently good team), but it's a little vague as to players. Is an influential player one who makes others want to succeed, makes a national impression, or possibly is of a gender that is almost not represented in quiz bowl (ahem)? If Kyle or someone could clarify that, it would help separate the good players from the ones who really made an impact.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by L-Town Expatriate »

Agree that I should clarify.

Influential would be someone who has inspired their teammates to succeed, set an example or benchmark in the event, or hidden driving forces behind a team. (I'm not sure if I'm clear on this so... debate amongst yourselves)
If we're looking for ten most awesome players based solely on stats, that could be another page. Here, let's look for dark horses, morale boosters, others that may have propelled teams to state championships. I could name three from Liberty alone.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by DeckardCain »

For "influence," I believe you have to look at a player's teammates, rather than the players themselves (well, you could influence yourself, I suppose...); whether they encourage or demean them, and, probably most importantly, how they perform after the player leaves. This is, sadly, why I would not put myself on this list, although my protégé, sophomore Cody Umfress, was impressive the last time I watched him play.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by Francesco Borromini »

Wow. Finally a meaningful category.

But yes, with regards to influential Andrew Fields from WCA would definitely make the list. He worked with the coach and the players around him to craft a well-balanced and dangerous team - with no previous experience or forbear to draw on, he created a team almost out of nowhere. The team he built will be just as strong for at least another years, which shows an impressive six-year influence on his part. That's gotta count for something.

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by TruePirate »

Chris Ottolino was influential..
and not just because of how good he was..but because of how great he was. How he carried a team..and enstilled fear into the hearts of players everywhere. There are lots of kids with top scores if you read the Class IV records...and yet, most of them remain unkown and forgotten...good players that never let themselves be known. Chris Ottolino was a player everyone knew. He also single handedly 180-ed the PCH debate team into the overwhelming death machine it is today. On top of that, he upped the reputation of the EMO Quiz Bowl team as a whole. Before him, were there any really notable teams from EMO? Savannah, NKC, Liberty.. these were the schools you heard about. Then suddenly, out of no where, a force to be reckoned with plowed out of Eastern Missouri and gave a striking blow to the teams before him. Although he never got the state title he so richly deserved, Chris Ottolino is probably one of the biggest reasons we ever did, and he's one of the biggest reasons that when people discuss quizbowl they even mention St. Louis.

East Buc has proven that there have been a few (like...2-3) players better than Chris Ottolino...but I don't think any player has ever done as much for the quiz bowl community (at least here in St. Louis) as he has done

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by East Buc & UMR »

oh sharon how I have missed you

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by tcarroll »

i don't think we've had anyone very influential. there was a guy named greg jones several years ago who was supposed to be very good, but i don't know how he really was or what he did while on the team.

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Post by L-Town Expatriate »

tcarroll wrote: i don't think we've had anyone very influential. there was a guy named greg jones several years ago who was supposed to be very good, but i don't know how he really was or what he did while on the team.
We could mention Maddog, but seeing as neither Scogs nor I have any questions from him for next month's BL3...

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Post by DavidH »

Totally off subject... how long is the poll release being delayed?

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by tcarroll »

tcarroll wrote: i don't think we've had anyone very influential. there was a guy named greg jones several years ago who was supposed to be very good, but i don't know how he really was or what he did while on the team.
We could mention Maddog, but seeing as neither Scogs nor I have any questions from him for next month's BL3...
Assuming Maddog is Matt Magruder, I know he was very good (as was Daniel Mun) but I don't know how "influential" either was. But they were both before my time by at least a year.

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Post by East Buc & UMR »

off subject is why we can create a new topic... and yes maddog is Matt

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by missouriacademic »

DavidH wrote: Totally off subject... how long is the poll release being delayed?
I think I'm just going to leave the polls the same until next month. There wasn't really enough information or votes to justify changing them.

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Post by DavidH »

Call me undemocratic, but I think that it would be great if a board of a couple of guys on here did the voting based upon their knowledge of Quiz Bowl within the state. This would require those guys to do the research, and it could be greatly helped if we started a new thread on here just for Records and Statistics. Most of the people on this board probably forget to cast a ballot or don't know enough teams to make an honest attempt at a top 10 in each class. So thats how I think the polling should be done.

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Post by East Buc & UMR »

just because people put you guys at 2 and WCA 1 does not mean you need to be bitter

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Post by L-Town Expatriate »

East Buc & UMR wrote: just because people put you guys at 2 and WCA 1 does not mean you need to be bitter
I voted Savannah over WCA. Although there was that 10-point slip up later avenged (AND HOW) against Lexington, WCA might have done the same thing.

I did send my ballot, didn't I?

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by DavidH »

East Buc & UMR Posted on Dec 18 2004, 04:41 PM
  just because people put you guys at 2 and WCA 1 does not mean you need to be bitter 


Forgive me for suggesting a different way of polling that might solve the problem of not enough people sending in ballots. It was just an idea.

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Post by East Buc & UMR »

I would say there are several reasons where there were no ballots most noteable being only about 4 tournaments max. But the reason that jumps out is the time of the year we are in.. I know I had more important things to do then sit down and make a poll up... This time of the year is just hetic.

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Post by L-Town Expatriate »

East Buc & UMR wrote: I would say there are several reasons where there were no ballots most noteable being only about 4 tournaments max. But the reason that jumps out is the time of the year we are in.. I know I had more important things to do then sit down and make a poll up... This time of the year is just hetic.
Yes, plus polls in the middle of December are useless, espeically since most Missouri teams don't start playing until January. As I recall, all of the Clarence Cannon Conference Duels start in February.

Besides, it's not the ranking at the beginning of the season that matters: It's the one on May 8!

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In light of this year being the tenth year

Post by DeckardCain »

I forgot to send mine in. I was planning on sending the same ballot as last time, because there's just not enough info yet.

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