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2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

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Jeffrey Hill
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2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by Jeffrey Hill » Sat Apr 08, 2017 2:49 pm

I put this post together pretty quickly so let me know if there are any errors

Sectionals (April 26, left team hosts)

Class 1
1: Leopold v. Bunker (330-190; 240-260; 240-200)
2: Bakersfield v. Thomas Jefferson Independent (2 games to 0)
3: Lakeland v. Drexel (410-220, 400-190)
4: Tuscumbia v. Wellsville (350-310; 330-320)
5: North Shelby v. Meadville (370-260; 340-220)
6: Slater v. Norborne (203-201(?) OT; 320-150)
7: Cainsville/Ridgeway v. King City (450-90; 380-100)
8: DeKalb v. Mound City (400-210; 320-320 OT)

Class 2
1: Portageville v. Bloomfield (2 games to 1)
2: Thayer v. Sparta (350-260; 340-180; @thayer_bobcats)
3: College Heights Christian v. Pleasant Hope (520-60, 400-220)
4: Osceola v. Lutheran (Kansas City) (430-210; 370-280)
5: South Callaway v. Calvary Lutheran (380-270; 360-220)
6: New Haven v. Louisiana (330-350; 470-240; 420-290)
7: Paris v. Scotland County (350-270; 270-170)
8: Polo v. Bishop LeBlond (370-310; 400-250; @LBAcademicTeam)

Class 3
1: Saxony Lutheran v. West County (340-290; 400-220; @westcor4)
2: Priory v. Orchard Farm (500-270; 520-330)
3: Cuba v. Salem (450-280; 480-120; @CubaHighSchool)
4: Strafford v. Reeds Spring (330-200; 310-240; @RSWolves)
5: Nevada v. Fatima (360-280; 290-360; 310-300)
6: St. Pius X v. Lafayette County (430-310; 420-350)
7: Hallsville v. Moberly (490-260; 430-310)
8: Trenton v. Savannah (560-190; 540-160)

Class 4
1: DeSoto v. Northwest (Cedar Hill) (2 games to 1)
2: Ladue v. MICDS (500-320; 440-430)
3: Washington v. Francis Howell (510-310; 440-400)
4: Fort Zumwalt North v. Hickman (410-390; 393-392 OT)
5: Kickapoo v. Carl Junction (430-310; 310-430; 360-310)
6: Rolla v. Smith-Cotton (480-190; 530-240)
7: Lee's Summit North v. North Kansas City (380-330; 470-240; @OKeefehistory)
8: Park Hill v. Central (St. Joseph) (600-200; 600-230)

-----------------------
State (Class 1 & 2 on May 5, Class 3 & 4 on May 6 at University of Missouri-Columbia)

Class 1
Round 1
Leopold vs. King City
Thomas Jefferson vs. Norborne
Lakeland vs. North Shelby
Wellsville vs. Mound City

Round 2
Leopold vs. Mound City
Thomas Jefferson vs. King City
Lakeland vs. Norborne
Wellsville vs. North Shelby

Round 3
Leopold vs. North Shelby
Thomas Jefferson vs. Mound City
Lakeland vs. King City
Wellsville vs. Norborne

Class 2
Round 1
Portageville vs. Scotland County
Thayer vs. Louisiana
College Heights vs. Calvary Lutheran
Osceola vs. Bishop LeBlond

Round 2
Portageville vs. Bishop LeBlond
Thayer vs. Scotland County
College Heights vs. Louisiana
Osceola vs. Calvary Lutheran

Round 3
Portageville vs. Calvary Lutheran
Thayer vs. Bishop LeBlond
College Heights vs. Scotland County
Osceola vs. Louisiana

Class 3
Round 1
West County vs. Hallsville
Orchard Farm vs. Lafayette County
Cuba vs. Fatima
Strafford vs. Savannah

Round 2
West County vs. Savannah
Orchard Farm vs. Hallsville
Cuba vs. Lafayette County
Strafford vs. Fatima

Round 3
West County vs. Fatima
Orchard Farm vs. Savannah
Cuba vs. Hallsville
Strafford vs. Lafayette County

Class 4
Round 1
Northwest vs. North Kansas City
Ladue vs. Rolla
Washington vs. Carl Junction
Hickman vs. Central (St. Joseph)

Round 2
Northwest vs. Central (St. Joseph)
Ladue vs. North Kansas City
Washington vs. Rolla
Hickman vs. Carl Junction

Round 3
Northwest vs. Carl Junction
Ladue vs. Central (St. Joseph)
Washington vs. North Kansas City
Hickman vs. Rolla
Last edited by Jeffrey Hill on Thu Apr 27, 2017 6:31 pm, edited 45 times in total.
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Jason Loy
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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by Jason Loy » Wed Apr 26, 2017 4:51 pm

C1D7/8:

Game 1: Wellsville 350, Tuscumbia 310
Game 2: Wellsville 330, Tuscumbia 320

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by scphilli » Wed Apr 26, 2017 4:57 pm

Class 4, sectional 2

Game 1: Ladue 500 MICDS 320

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by scphilli » Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:44 pm

Ladue won game 2.

440-430.

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by PenforPrez » Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:46 pm

Per Cuba High School on Twitter (@CubaHighSchool), Cuba wins their sectional. No scores, etc., posted.

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by L-Town Expatriate » Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:50 pm

Lakeland beat Drexel two games to none, scores of 410-220 and 400-190.

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by sportsrainman » Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:56 pm

Scores from Cuba/Salem
Cuba won Game 1 450-280
Cuba won Game 2 480-120

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by Jeffrey Hill » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:47 pm

I've seen results for all sectionals - most are officially reported to MSHSAA but a couple were found on Twitter.

Hastily compiled notes about the state championship history of the 32 schools advancing to State; hopefully I haven't misstated something:

Class 1
Wellsville: first appearance at State!
Leopold: 2nd appearance; 0-3 in 2013
Lakeland: 2nd (consecutive) appearance; 1-2 last year
King City: 4th appearance (3-6 in previous appearances), first since 2010 (1-2); seeking first top four finish
Norborne: 8th appearance (10-16 + 1 win by forfeit), first since 2004 (0-2 with bye win); 3rd place in 1997 and 1998
Mound City: 13th appearance (48-12), first since 2014 (3rd place); 6 time champion (last in 2012)
North Shelby: 16th appearance (24-33); 2nd consecutive (1-2 last year); 2nd place in 1997 and 1998
Thomas Jefferson: 19th (consecutive) appearance (70-16); defending champions (9th title)

1 new school
3 returning from last year (only the defending champion from last year's top 4)
3 schools that have already been to State at least 10 times
2 schools have previously won Class 1 (15 of 21 years); 4 schools have finished in the top 4
Norborne advanced to 7 of the first 9 championships, and is now returning after a 12 year absence
Thomas Jefferson aiming to become the second school with double digit state championships (Richland, 15 in Class 2)

Class 2
Osceola and Portageville: first appearances at State!
Thayer: 2nd appearance; 1-2 in 2009
Louisiana: 2nd (consecutive) appearance; 2nd last year (3-2)
Calvary Lutheran: 2nd (consecutive) appearance; defending champions (5-0)
Bishop LeBlond: 3rd appearance (2-6), first since 2002 (0-3); 4th place in 1998
Scotland County: 4th appearance (4-7), first since 2012 (1-2); 4th place in 1999
College Heights Christian: 11th appearance (24-18); 8th consecutive (3rd last year); 2nd place in 2007

2 new schools
Top 3 returning from last year
All but one school have made only 3 or fewer previous appearances at State
Calvary Lutheran is the only school that has previously won State (last year); 5 schools have finished in the top 4
Bishop LeBlond returning after a 14 year absence
Calvary Lutheran aiming to become the second Class 2 school to win consecutive championships (only Richland has won more than two in Class 2)

Class 3
West County and Fatima: first appearances at State!
Strafford: 3rd appearance (1-5); first since 2015 (1-2); seeking first top four finish
Lafayette County: 3rd (consecutive) appearance (2-4); 2-1 last year but missed playoffs on points; seeking first top four finish
Cuba: 5th appearance (16-2); first since 2000 (did not advance to playoffs); won the first 3 titles in Class 3
Orchard Farm: 5th appearance (11-7); 3rd consecutive; defending champions
Hallsville: 9th appearance (26-10); 6th consecutive (3rd last year); champions in 2014 and 2015
Savannah: 16th appearance (57-14); first since 2015 (2nd place); 6 time Class 3 champion (last in 2012)

2 new schools
3 returning from last year (including defending champion and 3rd place)
Only Savannah has been to State more than 10 times in the past
4 schools have previously won Class 3 (12 of 21 years); the other four schools are seeking their first top 4 finishes
Cuba advanced to 4 of the first 5 championships (winning the first 3), and is now returning after a 16 year absence
Savannah aiming to add another championship to their Class 3 leading total

Class 4
Northwest (Cedar Hill): first appearance at State!
Rolla: 2nd appearance; 0-3 in 2011
Carl Junction: 2nd (consecutive) appearance; 0-3 last year
Washington: 3rd appearance (0-6); 0-3 last year
Central (St. Joseph): 4th (consecutive) appearance (5-8); 4th place last year; 2nd place in 2015
Hickman: 7th appearance (18-8); 5th consecutive; defending champions
North Kansas City: 10th appearance (34-7); 1-2 last year; 6 time champion (last in 2008)
Ladue: 11th appearance (41-9); 2nd place last year; 6 time champion (last in 2014)

1 new school
6 returning from last year (including defending champion, 2nd, and 4th)
Only Ladue has been to State more than 10 times in the past (with NKC close behind)
3 schools have previously won Class 4 (13 of 21 years); Central has finished in second; the other three returning schools are looking for their first game win
Rolla returns after a 5 year absence
Ladue and NKC aiming to break the tie for most state championships in Class 4

Overall
6 schools making their first appearances at State (at least 1 in every class)
15 of 32 returning from last year (at least 3 in every class), including every defending champion, 2 second place, 2 third place, and 1 fourth place
3 schools returning after 12+ year absences (2 missed no more than 2 state tournaments prior to their extended absences)
Class 2 schools have only one previous state championship, but more top 4 finishing schools than any other class.

10 schools seeking another state championship (including 6 of 8 schools that have won at least 3), representing 41 of 84 total state championships
7 schools seeking to improve on a previous top four finish
9 previous attendees seeking their first top four finish (4 seeking their first game win)

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by bolshevik » Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:51 pm

Congrats to all sectional winners. Hope to see you all at state (I will hopefully be spectating Class 3 & 4 state as well!)

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by Jeffrey Hill » Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:05 pm

I received a request to open the private discussion forum for this set, which Jeff Hoppes of NAQT has approved. If you attended districts or sectionals, you may request access to the private discussion forum. Go to the usergroups page, find 2017 MSHSAA question discussion, and select Join. Jeff Hoppes or a board administrator must approve your request before you can view the forum.

Note that I've removed many accounts from the existing group from previous years, primarily people who have graduated, moved out of state, or haven't visited the board in a long time.

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by kstockman » Fri May 05, 2017 9:33 am

If you are not in Columbia this weekend and would like to follow the action for the State Tournament, you can check out this Google Form to check on live results.

Good luck to all teams!

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by Mickey0R0urke » Fri May 05, 2017 2:05 pm

The Class 2 championship game is a repeat from last year, with Louisiana facing Calvary Lutheran. In Class 1, Thomas Jefferson is facing Lakeland.

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by bolshevik » Fri May 05, 2017 4:01 pm

Mickey0R0urke wrote:The Class 2 championship game is a repeat from last year, with Louisiana facing Calvary Lutheran. In Class 1, Thomas Jefferson is facing Lakeland.
we got them boiz

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by Jeffrey Hill » Fri May 05, 2017 10:22 pm

Congratulations to Thomas Jefferson and Louisiana!

Interesting note: In 22 years of MSHSAA State, Louisiana is the first school north of US-50 (and the Missouri River) to win Class 2. (Barstow and Calvary Lutheran were the northernmost teams to win before this year, but both are still just south of 50.)

In comparison:

Classes 3 and 4 have had champions in the western and eastern parts of the state as well as northern, central, and southern.

Class 1's champions are concentrated in the western half of the state, with no champions east of US-63. In fact, it looks like North Shelby is the only school east of US-63 to ever make the Class 1 finals. (Granted, it looks like about 75-80% of current Class 1 schools are west of 63.) Koshkonong is the easternmost Class 1 champion, just off of the west side of 63 (and a little further east than North Shelby).

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by bolshevik » Sat May 06, 2017 10:10 pm

Comparisons between 2017 and 2016 results:
All four top brackets had at least one returning team - TJ in Class 1A, us and Calvary in Class 2A, Orchard Farm and Hallsville in Class 3A, and all but Washington in Class 4A.
Ladue and Central placed the same as last year, as did Hallsville and TJ. Hickman dropped to third, Calvary switched with us to second, and Orchard Farm dropped to second.

In all classes but 1A, two people remained in the same position in the All-State team as last year. However, in Class 1A, someone named Will still placed 2nd.
They were:
2A - Me and Remington Wilson
3A - Ross Simmons and Tyler Woosencraft
4A - William Gentry and Raj Paul

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by MCY » Tue May 09, 2017 2:50 pm

I know this is sour grapes, but the state of Class 3 is preposterous. We have schools as small as 265, all the way up to 780. No surprise, the largest school in the class won state. How is this is competitively fair. Interesting note, Savannah wouldn't have qualified to be in the recent NAQT small school national tournament, but our state says it's fair that they compete with schools below 500. I'm not mad at Savannah, they play where they're told to play. I hope this disparity is fixed.

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by PenforPrez » Tue May 09, 2017 4:17 pm

MCY wrote:I know this is sour grapes, but the state of Class 3 is preposterous. We have schools as small as 265, all the way up to 780. No surprise, the largest school in the class won state. How is this is competitively fair. Interesting note, Savannah wouldn't have qualified to be in the recent NAQT small school national tournament, but our state says it's fair that they compete with schools below 500. I'm not mad at Savannah, they play where they're told to play. I hope this disparity is fixed.
I just did some quick analysis on this using MSHSAA's school enrollment figures. Of the 32 Sectionals teams in 3A, Savannah was the largest at 780, but Nevada (which lost their sectional to Fatima) was a very close second at 777. Priory (with a 2.5x single-gender multiplier) and Moberly were both over 700. Among the 4A Sectionals teams, MICDS was the smallest by far at 874 (bumped up to 4A due to a different multiplier). The only other 4A school less than 1000 was Desoto.

There is also the huge preponderance of small schools that play. Most of those schools were playing when I started in the mid-90s. Richland, Pilot Grove, North Shelby, Purdy, etc., were all active then and still are now.

Savannah was in 4A for a number of years. I read the 3A championship in 2005 which Savannah lost to Westminster Christian, and I think that was their first year in 3A. I remember the ridiculousness of having Savannah, Liberty, and NKC as about the best three teams in the state having to fight it out in the *same district.* That's a whole other issue that still exists in St. Louis and will never be properly addressed, but that's a different argument for a different day.

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by scphilli » Tue May 09, 2017 9:05 pm

The debate over whether Savannah should be in 3 or 4A is one that has existed for 20 years and isn't likely to end anytime soon. They are either the smallest school in 4A as they were in the late 90s and parts of the last decade (Mr. Nelson forgets that for 2 years at least they were in 3A as they were when they won in 2002.) or the largest school in 3A. It's what happens when one tries to keep the classes relatively even number wise in terms of teams in each.

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by L-Town Expatriate » Tue May 09, 2017 9:37 pm

I have several thoughts on this concern, both as an alumnus of a program that was elated to not have Savannah in our district and classification for most of my high school career and as someone who has observed for sometime the immovable quirkiness of MSHSAA's classification system. A threadsplit of this particular item into a new general discussion thread may be necessary.

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by CentraliaCoach » Wed May 10, 2017 9:43 am

As someone who would probably have a state title (2011) were it not for Savannah's presence in class 3, I get the frustration. However, while the span of populations in class 3 may be shocking at first, when one starts looking at class 4, where you have schools that run from ~780 all the way to 2,800 (with multipliers in many cases), suddenly our objections seem less founded.

I've had to come to accept that, to reach our goals, my team has to become better than Savannah (and Hallsville, for that matter, or we're never getting to state anyway). This is largely because becoming better than them is certainly easier than getting MSHSAA to change *anything* about the way they do things.

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by Charlie Dees » Sun May 21, 2017 10:46 am

So, if you're going to approach a state championship from the baseline assumption that you want four classes with equal numbers of teams divided by population size, then you are going to have to cut off those classes somewhere, and the only way to make it fair is to do it blindly with indifference to the quality of the teams involved. Savannah is class 3 because they are in the third quartile of schools by size, and it doesn't matter where exactly within that quartile they fall. There's no debate to be had. If you want to say "oh they should move up to class 4 because they're on the bigger side of class 3 and because they win a lot," I mean, sorry, but that's not what a state championship is for. Rejiggering MSHSAA's population cutoffs because of Savannah would only serve to further cheapen their state series and make it less fair, and people should get it out of their head to jump to that complaint, because it's unfair to Savannah who regularly earns their spot as the best team in class 3 by the combination of working harder at quizbowl than most other teams and still being in the class 3 population range.

Also, it's not like Savannah is some kind of wealthy thriving suburban school. I've been there, there's nothing wrong with Savannah, but it's a small town of 5,000 people to the north of St. Joseph, which is not itself an urban area by any stretch of the imagination. It's an hour away from my old high school in suburban KC. I would imagine that Savannah has far more in common with other rural class 3 schools than it does with my 1,600 student suburban school, or at least that it occupies a liminal position.

However, that's all irrelevant. If Ladue were by population in class 3, they'd deserve to play in class 3, and if Savannah were in class 4 for the same reason they'd be stuck playing class 4, whether anybody likes it or not, because if you're going to have classes then you have to have a population cutoff somewhere. Savannah fell on the right side to win class 3, and good for them, they won class 3 fair and square, and there's nothing else to discuss.

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by FortOsageScholarBowl » Mon May 22, 2017 7:01 pm

At Fort, we've already decided that we will not worry about Districts as long as we have to play NKC. Don't get me wrong, I love the NKC guys, they are great. But, we haven't beaten them in the 5 years I've been here, and even with their top player graduating, I still am cautious about putting all of my efforts into the State series. The kids hate the 4 quarter games, because they take so freaking long, but they play and that's all that matters. I know that runs counter to Stacy's declaration, "That the state stuff is more important than Nationals." If we believed that crap, we'd be home every summer...

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by Charlie Dees » Tue May 23, 2017 3:07 am

Did Stacy Schroeder really say that?

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Re: 2017 MSHSAA Sectionals/State

Post by FortOsageScholarBowl » Tue May 23, 2017 10:59 am

Yep. I parsed it for clarity, but she said that the "MSHSAA Board" considers Missouri stuff more important than Nationals. It was all I could do not to say something. I am assuming that is the reason why we are the only state that doesn't allow wildcard bids to Nationals, and that we allow a minority of largely inactive coaches to dictate that we keep a question format that no other state uses.

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